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Bible Questions

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Bible Questions

Post by Yidda on Sun Sep 12, 2010 10:17 pm

Does anyone have any questions about the Bible, either about the various languages, editions, manuscripts, authorship , or about specific difficult passages?

Please post your honest questions in this thread.
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Jewel on Tue Sep 14, 2010 1:46 pm

Yidda wrote:Does anyone have any questions about the Bible, either about the various languages, editions, manuscripts, authorship , or about specific difficult passages?

Please post your honest questions in this thread.

Yes I do have some:

Based on my study about the bible, the first thing that came in to my mind is the authors of the different books of the bible, and what i found is that many writers of the different books of the bible both OT and NT are either uncertain or totally unknown.

Example: OT; The books of Numbers, Chronicles and Kings - Who wrote them really?

Example: NT; The book of Hebrews, who really wrote it?

There have been guesses, "may be's" - but there is no certainty.


Any positive comments there?



Thanks
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Yidda on Wed Sep 15, 2010 1:18 pm

Jewel wrote:

Yes I do have some:

Based on my study about the bible, the first thing that came in to my mind is the authors of the different books of the bible, and what i found is that many writers of the different books of the bible both OT and NT are either uncertain or totally unknown.

Example: OT; The books of Numbers, Chronicles and Kings - Who wrote them really?

Example: NT; The book of Hebrews, who really wrote it?

There have been guesses, "may be's" - but there is no certainty.


Any positive comments there?

Thanks


Hebrews is believed to have been written either by Paul, or by a disciple of Paul.

Some of the OT books were not written by one person, but by a number of authors and editors over a period of time. All of Sacred Scripture is the inspired writing of the Holy Spirit. Regardless of which persons or how many persons wrote any book of the Bible, God remains the One True Author of all. John wrote his Gospel, but some other persons completed it, all under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Paul wrote his letters, but with help from Tertius, Sosthenes, Timothy, Silvanus, and perhaps others. Yet each book of the Bible is entirely the work of the One God, Who is Author of all. It does not matter who the human authors were, since the One Supreme Author is God.
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Jewel on Wed Sep 15, 2010 2:55 pm

Yidda wrote:


Hebrews is believed to have been written either by Paul, or by a disciple of Paul.

Some of the OT books were not written by one person, but by a number of authors and editors over a period of time. All of Sacred Scripture is the inspired writing of the Holy Spirit. Regardless of which persons or how many persons wrote any book of the Bible, God remains the One True Author of all. John wrote his Gospel, but some other persons completed it, all under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Paul wrote his letters, but with help from Tertius, Sosthenes, Timothy, Silvanus, and perhaps others. Yet each book of the Bible is entirely the work of the One God, Who is Author of all. It does not matter who the human authors were, since the One Supreme Author is God.

The question was WHO WROTE THOSE BOOKS, (The books of Numbers, Chronicles and Kings) but I see no name, not one. WHY??

So you are confirming that what I said about the anonymous/uncertain authors of many books of the bible is true. Wow!

It seems to me that you just believe that the bible is 100% authentic simply because you are told to do so despite the fact that you are well informed/aware that it is not - dont you realize that it's a kind of blind faith?

I mean, why dont you accept the book of mormons or the hindu scriptures; they are believed to be words of God too, and just exactly the same with the bible, the authors are unknown.
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Yidda on Wed Sep 15, 2010 5:04 pm

It does not matter who the human authors were, since the One Supreme Author is God.

God is incapable of error of any kind on any subject. God Who is Truth cannot lie or speak a falsehood. For the Divine Nature of God is not merely truthful, as if truthfulness were a non-essential quality, but rather the Divine Nature is Truth.

Therefore, everything asserted bythe Holy Spirit, on any subject whatsoever, is certainly the truth. For He cannot deny Himself (2 Timothy 2:13). Since Dei Verbum teaches that“everything asserted by the inspired authors or sacred writers must be held to be asserted by the Holy Spirit,” there can be no error of any kind in Sacred Scripture, on any subject about which Sacred Scripture makes an assertion, and this doctrine must be believed.
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Jewel on Thu Sep 16, 2010 2:47 am

Yidda wrote:It does not matter who the human authors were, since the One Supreme Author is God.

But how do you know that the author is God, is it because the bible says so?? That's clear circular reasoning dear sister yidda.

The point is the same, you have to accept the book of mormons and the vedas of the hindu as books from God too because they say so.


God is incapable of error of any kind on any subject. God Who is Truth cannot lie or speak a falsehood. For the Divine Nature of God is not merely truthful, as if truthfulness were a non-essential quality, but rather the Divine Nature is Truth.


The point is that since your bible does contain errors, it means that it is not from God because God is free from error while your bible is not - That's the bottom line there.

Therefore, everything asserted bythe Holy Spirit, on any subject whatsoever, is certainly the truth. For He cannot deny Himself (2 Timothy 2:13). Since Dei Verbum teaches that“everything asserted by the inspired authors or sacred writers must be held to be asserted by the Holy Spirit,” there can be no error of any kind in Sacred Scripture, on any subject about which Sacred Scripture makes an assertion, and this doctrine must be believed.

That's blind following. The hindus has got the same belief on their books too, so why dont you become a hindu and worship their idols?

No matter how many times and how strong is the claim that it is from God, but we see errors in it, then it can NOT be from God because God cant make errors.

Since your bible is unauthentic and has many errors, therefore it is not God's word no matter how strong is the claim....
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Yidda on Thu Sep 16, 2010 3:15 pm

Jewel wrote:

But how do you know that the author is God, is it because the bible says so?? That's clear circular reasoning dear sister yidda.

The point is the same, you have to accept the book of mormons and the vedas of the hindu as books from God too because they say so.

Christ himself said so.

Christ himself said [John] {10:35} ... Scripture cannot be broken,

Christ found a church a teaching church, His teaching church had been in existence for over a decade before the first of the NT was even written.
Jewel wrote:

The point is that since your bible does contain errors, it means that it is not from God because God is free from error while your bible is not - That's the bottom line there.
Scripture is without error, even in scientific or historical matters. Some passages are to some extent, figurative, not literal.

Jewel wrote:
That's blind following. The hindus has got the same beliefon their books too, so why dont you become a hindu and worship their idols?

No matter how many times and how strong is the claim that it is from God, butwe see errors in it, then it can NOT be from God because God cant make errors.

Since your bible is unauthentic and has many errors, therefore it is not God'sword no matter how strong is the claim....

Scripture is without error in all that it asserts as true.The entire Bible was written by the Holy Spirit.

Now

Jesus has found his Church upon the solid rock of the Apostle Peter. To peter, Jesus has given the task of being the foundation of the Church and of safeguarding all her truth. For peter, Jesus has prayed that his faith might remain intact throughout the whole course of human history. To Peter, He has given the sure guarantee of his victory: the power of hell will not prevail.

The task entrusted to Peter is handed down to his successors. Thus the Pope becomes today the foundation upon which the church is built, the center where there converge her charity and assurance to ever maintain the deposit of faith.
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by gin on Fri Sep 17, 2010 3:12 am

Yidda wrote:Does anyone have any questions about the Bible, either about the various languages, editions, manuscripts, authorship , or about specific difficult passages?

Please post your honest questions in this thread.

Who wrote the 'Bible'?
Is the Bible 'holy'?

Thanks in advance
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Dhugz on Fri Sep 17, 2010 8:38 am

Sa Old testament ang nagsulat ng Bibliya ay mga Propeta na mga Hudyo, and the New Testament wrote by the Catholics in the first ce. Yes Holy ang Bibliya dahil Holy ang Church na nagcompiled at nagcnon nito at Holy din ang mga Propeta at mg katolikong nagsulat dito. Take note walang sinulat diyan ang mga protestante.
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by gin on Fri Sep 17, 2010 9:05 am

Dhugz wrote:Sa Old testament ang nagsulat ng Bibliya ay mga Propeta na mga Hudyo, and the New Testament wrote by the Catholics in the first ce. Yes Holy ang Bibliya dahil Holy ang Church na nagcompiled at nagcnon nito at Holy din ang mga Propeta at mg katolikong nagsulat dito. Take note walang sinulat diyan ang mga protestante.

Thanks sa response, Pareng Dhugz

Here's my follow up Qs:

How holy is the Bible?
How holy is the 'Church' who compiled the Bible?
Did God actually asked them to compile and canon the so called 'Holy Bible' that we use today? Site your credible and reliable source/s for reference, please.

Many thanks
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by MarcCatholic on Fri Sep 17, 2010 11:16 am

Kuya Jewel, diba sinasabi nyo pong maraming mali sa bibliya na kung saan kayo lang naman po ang nagsasabi niyan bilang muslim at palagay ko sa opinyon nyo yon, maganda siguro na magsimula ka ng thread kuya Jewel kung saan isa-isahin mo ang mga palagay mong pagkakamali ng bibliya. Salamat.
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Dhugz on Fri Sep 17, 2010 1:10 pm

gin wrote:

Thanks sa response, Pareng Dhugz

Here's my follow up Qs:

How holy is the Bible?
How holy is the 'Church' who compiled the Bible?
Did God actually asked them to compile and canon the so called 'Holy Bible' that we use today? Site your credible and reliable source/s for reference, please.

Many thanks

Jesus build his Catholic Church as we read in the Matthew 16:18, and he gave the keys or the authority to the Church, anuman daw ang kakalagan at itatali dito sa lupa ay mangyayari din sa langit na ating mababasa sa Matthew 16:19. Now, how holy is the Bible? Because the Church is Holy, why? Thee Church is founded by God Himself. Jesus not actually asked the Church to compile nd canonized the Bible, but he gave the keys or divine authority to the Church. Even the Bible itself gave the credits to the Church, that the Pillar and Ground of the Truth is the Church(1 tim 3:15).
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by adanedhel on Fri Sep 17, 2010 7:12 pm

I paraphrase St. Augustine's quote about the Bible's authenticity..."kung 'di lang sinabi ng Simbahang Katoliko na kapani-paniwala ang Bibliya, 'di ako maniniwala nyan."

I wonder why the Protestants believed in the Bible...no circular reasoning please.
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Jewel on Fri Sep 17, 2010 11:42 pm

MarcCatholic wrote:Kuya Jewel, diba sinasabi nyo pong maraming mali sa bibliya na kung saan kayo lang naman po ang nagsasabi niyan bilang muslim at palagay ko sa opinyon nyo yon, maganda siguro na magsimula ka ng thread kuya Jewel kung saan isa-isahin mo ang mga palagay mong pagkakamali ng bibliya. Salamat.

Fair enough, tama ka dyan marc, equal status tayo dyan; kita mo naman sya yidda, kahit aminado sya na maraming authors ng bible ang unknown, matindi parin ang belief nya sa bible, at normal lang yon kasi katolik sya (bible believer). In the same way, maaaring sinasabi kong may mga mali ang bibliya dahil Muslim ako at hindi bible believer, so ano ba talaga, may mali o wala?

siguro di na kelangan gumawa ng new thread kasi I think this is the right thread for the issue, at para madali hanapin ang mga topics related to biblical issues.

Ganito nalang, try ko maglagay ng errors of the bible dito tapos try nyo sagutin na hindi ginagamitan ng circular argument para neutral ang response. Si yidda kasi circular argument ang response nya (the bible says it so it must be true).

1. Unang issue na hindi pa naresolba ay authorship ng some books of the bible ay either unknown or uncertain - there is no way to authenticate the book because we dont really know for sure who wrote them. Examples are books of Kings, Chronicles, Hebrews, ect - aminado na ba kayo na until today NO ONE KNOW FOR SURE who really were the writers of those books?

If your answer is "well, since the church included them in the canon then we should believe in them as words of God"


Try to take note that whether you believe them to be word of God or not does not resolve the problem because your belief has nothing to do with the anonymous authors of those books, right?


So do you have any proper response to this question? BTW, any catholic can answer the question.

I'll post my next question after the above issue has been resolved.


Thanks
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Jewel on Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:18 pm

wala na bang balak sumagot dito?
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Dhugz on Sun Sep 19, 2010 6:51 pm

Jewell, ang makakasagot talaga sa iyon tungkol diyan ay ang Church, the Church is proven na itinatag na ito noong unang siglo at pinatunayan ng mga miracles na totoo ang Iglesia Katolika na hindi naman natin nakikita sa ibang Relihiyon, sapat na sakin ang mga miracles na nangyari sa Iglesia upang paniwalaan ang kanyang kinanon na Bibliya, if the Church is in error sana hindi na nananahan ang Diyos dito, sana kinontra ng Diyos mismo na nagtatag sa Iglesia ang pagkacanon ng Bibliya.
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Jewel on Sun Sep 19, 2010 8:00 pm

Dhugz wrote:Jewell, ang makakasagot talaga sa iyon tungkol diyan ay ang Church, the Church is proven na itinatag na ito noong unang siglo at pinatunayan ng mga miracles na totoo ang Iglesia Katolika na hindi naman natin nakikita sa ibang Relihiyon, sapat na sakin ang mga miracles na nangyari sa Iglesia upang paniwalaan ang kanyang kinanon na Bibliya, if the Church is in error sana hindi na nananahan ang Diyos dito, sana kinontra ng Diyos mismo na nagtatag sa Iglesia ang pagkacanon ng Bibliya.

Thank you igan dhugz, i fully respect your very strong belief, trust, and reliance to the church - that's a very strong faith indeed.

However, if you are not a christian, and you are given that kind of response to the question, doesn't it sound that the response is definitely a circular argument if you weigh it objectively?

Moreover, if you put the integrity of the church at risk on the problem presented, wouldn't it show that the church is in fact unreliable because it cant show/answer where did they get those books.

Lastly, the same church had declared some books to be apocryphal (aside from what is also considered by protestants to be the 7 apocryphal books in the catholic bible) because of unknown authors/origin/spurious, YET we find many books of unknown authors with in the canonized bible -


Thanks
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Dhugz on Sun Sep 19, 2010 8:29 pm

Jewel wrote:

Thank you igan dhugz, i fully respect your very strong belief, trust, and reliance to the church - that's a very strong faith indeed.

However, if you are not a christian, and you are given that kind of response to the question, doesn't it sound that the response is definitely a circular argument if you weigh it objectively?

Moreover, if you put the integrity of the church at risk on the problem presented, wouldn't it show that the church is in fact unreliable because it cant show/answer where did they get those books.

Lastly, the same church had declared some books to be apocryphal (aside from what is also considered by protestants to be the 7 apocryphal books in the catholic bible) because of unknown authors/origin/spurious, YET we find many books of unknown authors with in the canonized bible -


Thanks

Napakataas ng integridad ng Iglesia Imagine the Bible is not just compiled and canonized in a single Council na naganap sa history of the Church, may series councils na siyang nag aral. pinagdebtehan ng husto ng mga Church Fathers, ang tanong ninyo na iyan ay naging katanungan din mismo sa mga councils of the Church. Lalo na noong Council of Trent na pinakamatagal na Council ang naganap sa history of the Church pero ano ang nangyari, lalo lamang napatatag ang Canon of Scripture na ginanap sa mga nagdaang Councila, diyan makikita na di lutong macau ang Bibliya unlike sa mga ibang tinuturing na sacred scriptures na hindi man lang binusisi ng maigi at ginawa at gawa gawa lang ng iilang tao o ng iisang tinuturing na mensahero o propeta. The Church ay mayroong Tradition which is the basis of the Canon of Scripture. Pag sinabi kasing Sacred Tradition ito yung minana pa ng Church mula noong unang siglo mula sa mga Unang Priests and Bishops na kung saan sila ang mga tinatawag na Apostol. Ang Tradition na ito ay written or in oral. Ako din naman di maniniwala sa Bibliya without the authority of the Church. Dahil sa Tradition na iyon, ay natrace ng Iglesia kung sino sino ang nagsulat ng mga aklat ng Bibliya at mga aklat na itinuturing na spurious at mga apocrypha, kaya kahit halimbawa kung ikaw ay nagsulat ng isang aklat na di mo inilagay ang pangalan mo pero may isa kang kaibigan na nakakilala sa iyo na ikaw ang nagsulat noon, eh di matutukoy pa din in the end kung sino ang author ng sinulat mo di ba? Ganyan ang nangyari sa Bibliya, yung mga aklat na hindi lantad kung sino ang author, ay mga statement ang mga Church Fathers noong unang siglo na mismong nakasama nila yung author, kaya inipon at itinago lahat ng Iglesia lahat ng mga Documents na pwedeng makilala ang pagkakakilanlan kung sino ang mga author ng mga aklat ng Bibliya na di lantarang hayag. My Friend inuulit ko, mas paniniwalaan ko ang aklat na pinagtibay, pinag aralan, pinagsunugan ng kilay ng hundred of years kesa sa aklat na isang araw, o isang buwan o isang taon lang ginawa ng iilan lamang, pwede kasing pure stsismis lahat yung nakasulat sa aklat na iyon di ba?
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Jewel on Sun Sep 19, 2010 8:49 pm

Dhugz wrote:

Napakataas ng integridad ng Iglesia Imagine the Bible is not just compiled and canonized in a single Council na naganap sa history of the Church, may series councils na siyang nag aral. pinagdebtehan ng husto ng mga Church Fathers, ang tanong ninyo na iyan ay naging katanungan din mismo sa mga councils of the Church. Lalo na noong Council of Trent na pinakamatagal na Council ang naganap sa history of the Church pero ano ang nangyari, lalo lamang napatatag ang Canon of Scripture na ginanap sa mga nagdaang Councila, diyan makikita na di lutong macau ang Bibliya unlike sa mga ibang tinuturing na sacred scriptures na hindi man lang binusisi ng maigi at ginawa at gawa gawa lang ng iilang tao o ng iisang tinuturing na mensahero o propeta. The Church ay mayroong Tradition which is the basis of the Canon of Scripture. Pag sinabi kasing Sacred Tradition ito yung minana pa ng Church mula noong unang siglo mula sa mga Unang Priests and Bishops na kung saan sila ang mga tinatawag na Apostol. Ang Tradition na ito ay written or in oral. Ako din naman di maniniwala sa Bibliya without the authority of the Church. Dahil sa Tradition na iyon, ay natrace ng Iglesia kung sino sino ang nagsulat ng mga aklat ng Bibliya at mga aklat na itinuturing na spurious at mga apocrypha, kaya kahit halimbawa kung ikaw ay nagsulat ng isang aklat na di mo inilagay ang pangalan mo pero may isa kang kaibigan na nakakilala sa iyo na ikaw ang nagsulat noon, eh di matutukoy pa din in the end kung sino ang author ng sinulat mo di ba? Ganyan ang nangyari sa Bibliya, yung mga aklat na hindi lantad kung sino ang author, ay mga statement ang mga Church Fathers noong unang siglo na mismong nakasama nila yung author, kaya inipon at itinago lahat ng Iglesia lahat ng mga Documents na pwedeng makilala ang pagkakakilanlan kung sino ang mga author ng mga aklat ng Bibliya na di lantarang hayag. My Friend inuulit ko, mas paniniwalaan ko ang aklat na pinagtibay, pinag aralan, pinagsunugan ng kilay ng hundred of years kesa sa aklat na isang araw, o isang buwan o isang taon lang ginawa ng iilan lamang, pwede kasing pure stsismis lahat yung nakasulat sa aklat na iyon di ba?

I really appreciate your reliance to the church igan dhugz, amazing faith!


But still, that doesnt answer the main question, who wrote those books?

As you have mentioned, it has been a subject of discussion in the early church about the authorship of those books which i mentioned, and we dont really know how the debate was decided, but let's assume that the church successfully traced up the real authors - why cant they tell us who they are until now? moreover, it is not that they dont wanna tell us who the authors were, but they even boldly admitted that THEY DONT KNOW the authors of those books.

It implies that you believe the bible to be authentic just because you are told by the catholic church to do so, and not because the authors are certainly known; is that correct?


Thanks
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Dhugz on Sun Sep 19, 2010 9:23 pm

Jewel wrote:

I really appreciate your reliance to the church igan dhugz, amazing faith!


But still, that doesnt answer the main question, who wrote those books?

As you have mentioned, it has been a subject of discussion in the early church about the authorship of those books which i mentioned, and we dont really know how the debate was decided, but let's assume that the church successfully traced up the real authors - why cant they tell us who they are until now? moreover, it is not that they dont wanna tell us who the authors were, but they even boldly admitted that THEY DONT KNOW the authors of those books.

It implies that you believe the bible to be authentic just because you are told by the catholic church to do so, and not because the authors are certainly known; is that correct?


Thanks

Sinabi naman na nila eh, di ba? gaya nung Gospel according to St. Matthew at iba pa..... Tama ka sa huling statement mo, why should I believe in the Bible without believing the Church? Kahit wala pa ang Bibliya the Church is the Church, which is the Pillar and Ground for the Truth. Di naman ang Bibliya ang nagbasehan ni Cristo para itatag ang Church kundi ang Bibliya ay nabuo dahil sa Divine authority na ibinigay ng Diyos sa kanyang Iglesia.
Napakaganda Jewel at nagtatanong po kayo tungkol sa Church, though confused kayo sa Christianity because of many Protestants sects. Ok iyan, sana later on maiintindihan niyo ang stand of the Church at malay natin mas saradong katoliko ka pa sa amin. That's good sign mula sa iyo my Friend.
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Jewel on Sun Sep 19, 2010 9:32 pm

Dhugz wrote:

Sinabi naman na nila eh, di ba? gaya nung Gospel according to St. Matthew at iba pa..... Tama ka sa huling statement mo, why should I believe in the Bible without believing the Church? Kahit wala pa ang Bibliya the Church is the Church, which is the Pillar and Ground for the Truth. Di naman ang Bibliya ang nagbasehan ni Cristo para itatag ang Church kundi ang Bibliya ay nabuo dahil sa Divine authority na ibinigay ng Diyos sa kanyang Iglesia.
Napakaganda Jewel at nagtatanong po kayo tungkol sa Church, though confused kayo sa Christianity because of many Protestants sects. Ok iyan, sana later on maiintindihan niyo ang stand of the Church at malay natin mas saradong katoliko ka pa sa amin. That's good sign mula sa iyo my Friend.

Actually igan dhugz, kung hindi ako kombinsido sa Islam at Christianity lang ang option ko, sa Katoliko ako magpapasakop kasi kompara sa ibang sekta ng kristyanismo, ang katolik church ang may masasabi nating malapit na link sa mga sinaunang kristyanos, at ang mga ibang sekta ay nangopya at nanggamit lang sa mga output ng katolik church, walang originality.

anyway, balik sa paksa. Isa sa mga malalaking reasons, actually primary reason, kung bakit hindi ako kombesido sa Christian doctrines ay dahil sa authenticity ng scripture na kung saan binabase ang faith.

Sa Islam kasi kapag malabo ang source is considered weak at hindi pinagbabasihan. Hindi lang basta kilala ang author kundi dapat siguradong sya nga ang author talaga with a strong chain of reliable narrators.


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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Dhugz on Sun Sep 19, 2010 11:02 pm

Jewel wrote:

Actually igan dhugz, kung hindi ako kombinsido sa Islam at Christianity lang ang option ko, sa Katoliko ako magpapasakop kasi kompara sa ibang sekta ng kristyanismo, ang katolik church ang may masasabi nating malapit na link sa mga sinaunang kristyanos, at ang mga ibang sekta ay nangopya at nanggamit lang sa mga output ng katolik church, walang originality.

anyway, balik sa paksa. Isa sa mga malalaking reasons, actually primary reason, kung bakit hindi ako kombesido sa Christian doctrines ay dahil sa authenticity ng scripture na kung saan binabase ang faith.

Sa Islam kasi kapag malabo ang source is considered weak at hindi pinagbabasihan. Hindi lang basta kilala ang author kundi dapat siguradong sya nga ang author talaga with a strong chain of reliable narrators.


Thanks

Sa amin scripture is just one of the basis of our faith, kaya nga di kami scripture alone di ba?
Ok with regards sa authenticity ng Bibliya, ang Church ang nakakaalam niyan, kaya nga pinagdebatehan di ba ng napakaraming taon almost 1000 years na pinagdedebatehan ang Bibliya, ibig sabihin nun lahat sana ng butas na makikita sa Bibliya eh wala na kasi sobrang naiprove na sa mundo that the Bible is authentic and free from errors, sa aming Catholic Faith the Church is infallible, pero ipinakita pa rin ng Church sa mundo na hindi moro moro yung pagkakacompile ng Bible bagkus ipinakita nito na tama at authentic ang Bible sa pamamagitan ng series councils, to examine the weakness side of the canonization of the bible, hindi tumigil ng iglesia sa iisang Canon bagkus sunod sunod pa iyan to make sure na free from error ito. Alam naman ng pangkalahatan na ang Church ay di basta basta nagdedeclare na authenctic ang isang bagay, halimbawa sa mga miracles, kahit gaano pa kagenuine ang isang apparitions o ng mga miracles sa Church, ang Church idinadaan lahat sa mga proseso para mapatunayan lamang na tama o genuine nga iyong miracles naa iyon, may scientific evidence at marami pang iba, kaya minsan inaabot ng 10 or 20 years minsan sa pagdedeklara ng mga ganyan eh, ksi masyadong strict ang Simbahan sa mga ganyan eh, ayaw nila ng moro morong pag aaral. Yung Priest nalang 11 years yan nag aral, imagine pati latin, greek at hebrew pinag aaralan din nila iyan, para lamang lalo nilang maintindihan ang unang aklat ng simbahan at mga original na salin ng Bibliya. Ganyan po, kaya siguradong sigurado kami sa Bibliya dahil ito ay di gawang tsismis lang, we have the Sacred Tradition na siyang batayan ng Simbahan sa pagkanon ng Bibliya. Yung unbroken line of succession nalang ng mga Priest mula sa mga apostol napakalaking batayan na iyon di ba? At alam naman natin na bawat document sa bawat siglo meron ang Iglesia kaya yan, imposibleng magkamali sila sa Bibliya, isa pa ang mga Kristiyano noon ay handang mamatay alang alang sa Iglesia, maraming katoliko ang pinatay ng mga pagano, madaming hinusgahan ng mga hudyo na mga Kristiyano, yung mga pari nga sa sa Latin Rite at Bishops sa Greek Catholic at sa Roman Rite eh walang asawa, ibig sabihin lamang po iyon talagang makikita natin na mga sincere ang mga taong ito para sa kapakanan ng Iglesia na tatag ng ating Panginoon. My friend siguro enough na iyan para mapatunayan lang na authentic ang Bibliya, may mga statement ang Simbahan tungkol diyan,kung gusto mo ng one by one na pagsasaliksik tungkol sa aming Bibliya, merong sagot diyan, masyado kasing mahaba pag isa isahin natin kung pano nalaman ng Iglesia ang mga author nang mga aklat ng Bibliya na di hayag dito. Try to use google or ask some of the Most intelligent Catholic Apologist, kasi karamihan sa kanila nag aral sa pagkapari .
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Jewel on Mon Sep 20, 2010 2:47 am

Dhugz wrote:

Sa amin scripture is just one of the basis of our faith, kaya nga di kami scripture alone di ba?
Ok with regards sa authenticity ng Bibliya, ang Church ang nakakaalam niyan, kaya nga pinagdebatehan di ba ng napakaraming taon almost 1000 years na pinagdedebatehan ang Bibliya, ibig sabihin nun lahat sana ng butas na makikita sa Bibliya eh wala na kasi sobrang naiprove na sa mundo that the Bible is authentic and free from errors, sa aming Catholic Faith the Church is infallible, pero ipinakita pa rin ng Church sa mundo na hindi moro moro yung pagkakacompile ng Bible bagkus ipinakita nito na tama at authentic ang Bible sa pamamagitan ng series councils, to examine the weakness side of the canonization of the bible, hindi tumigil ng iglesia sa iisang Canon bagkus sunod sunod pa iyan to make sure na free from error ito. Alam naman ng pangkalahatan na ang Church ay di basta basta nagdedeclare na authenctic ang isang bagay, halimbawa sa mga miracles, kahit gaano pa kagenuine ang isang apparitions o ng mga miracles sa Church, ang Church idinadaan lahat sa mga proseso para mapatunayan lamang na tama o genuine nga iyong miracles naa iyon, may scientific evidence at marami pang iba, kaya minsan inaabot ng 10 or 20 years minsan sa pagdedeklara ng mga ganyan eh, ksi masyadong strict ang Simbahan sa mga ganyan eh, ayaw nila ng moro morong pag aaral. Yung Priest nalang 11 years yan nag aral, imagine pati latin, greek at hebrew pinag aaralan din nila iyan, para lamang lalo nilang maintindihan ang unang aklat ng simbahan at mga original na salin ng Bibliya. Ganyan po, kaya siguradong sigurado kami sa Bibliya dahil ito ay di gawang tsismis lang, we have the Sacred Tradition na siyang batayan ng Simbahan sa pagkanon ng Bibliya. Yung unbroken line of succession nalang ng mga Priest mula sa mga apostol napakalaking batayan na iyon di ba? At alam naman natin na bawat document sa bawat siglo meron ang Iglesia kaya yan, imposibleng magkamali sila sa Bibliya, isa pa ang mga Kristiyano noon ay handang mamatay alang alang sa Iglesia, maraming katoliko ang pinatay ng mga pagano, madaming hinusgahan ng mga hudyo na mga Kristiyano, yung mga pari nga sa sa Latin Rite at Bishops sa Greek Catholic at sa Roman Rite eh walang asawa, ibig sabihin lamang po iyon talagang makikita natin na mga sincere ang mga taong ito para sa kapakanan ng Iglesia na tatag ng ating Panginoon. My friend siguro enough na iyan para mapatunayan lang na authentic ang Bibliya, may mga statement ang Simbahan tungkol diyan,kung gusto mo ng one by one na pagsasaliksik tungkol sa aming Bibliya, merong sagot diyan, masyado kasing mahaba pag isa isahin natin kung pano nalaman ng Iglesia ang mga author nang mga aklat ng Bibliya na di hayag dito. Try to use google or ask some of the Most intelligent Catholic Apologist, kasi karamihan sa kanila nag aral sa pagkapari .

Sige po igan dhugz, hintay nalang tayo ng ibang may alam sa bible baka alam nila ang authors ng mga books na yun.

sa research ko kasi, wala talagang nakakaalam kung sino talaga ang authors ng mga books na yun. pati si Dr. Willian Laine Craig, at Dr. James White ay aminado tungkol dyan.


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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Dhugz on Mon Sep 20, 2010 7:11 pm

Jewel baka dito malinawan ka. http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/11646c.htm
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Re: Bible Questions

Post by Jewel on Mon Sep 20, 2010 8:51 pm

Dhugz wrote:Jewel baka dito malinawan ka. http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/11646c.htm

Same thing igan dhugz, hindi parin alam kung sino-sino ang mga authors ng I, II Kings, Chronicles, ect. lahat "MAY BE"

Ang masaklap, here is the confession from that article:

But Catholic tradition does not necessarily maintain that Moses wrote every letter of the Pentateuch as it is today, and that the work has come down to us in an absolutely unchanged form.


Yung pentateuch nga hindi pa pala siguradong kay Moses lahat, eh mas lalo na yung I, II Kings, Chronicles, ect, at Hebrew. Yun po ang concern ko dyan - The authors of many books that were included in the bible are unknown until today. So how could we authenticate and rely a writing in which its author is unknown?

Babalik at babalik parin dun sa argument na " since the church included them in the canon, then they must be authentic" - which is a very weak stand kasi circular ang reasoning.


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