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Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

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Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Sun Apr 03, 2011 11:06 pm

Madalas na ang topic dito ay ang pagkabit ng mga anti-islam na ang mga terorista ay tunay na tagasunod ng Allah, ngayon atin itong pag-usapan.

Ang sabi ng Allah sa banal na Quran.

3:117. What they spend in the life of this (material) world May be likened to a wind which brings a nipping frost: It strikes and destroys the harvest of men who have wronged their own souls: it is not Allah that hath wronged them, but they wrong themselves.

3:118. O ye who believe! Take not into your intimacy those outside your ranks: They will not fail to corrupt you. They only desire your ruin: Rank hatred has already appeared from their mouths: What their hearts conceal is far worse. We have made plain to you the Signs, if ye have wisdom.


Ano ba ang nais iparating ng Allah sa kapahayagan niyang ito, sakop ba ang mga pumapatay ng mga inosente at nagsasabing sila ay sa Allah subhana wa taalah.


Atin tunghayan at basahin ang nasa talatang ito.


4:29 O ye who believe! Eat not up your property among yourselves in vanities: But let there be amongst you Traffic and trade by mutual good-will: Nor kill (or destroy) yourselves: for verily Allah hath been to you Most Merciful!

Masasabi ba natin na sa Allah ang mga nagpapatiwakal at nagpapasabog ng kanilang sarili para sa sariling interes, narito ang nasa talatang iyan inyong basahin.

Nor kill (or destroy) yourselves = وَلَا تَقْتُلُوا أَنفُسَكُمْ

Ang sabi ng Allah ay ang buhay ay sagrado at walang puwedeng kumitil nito maliban lang kung hindi sinasadya o idinadaan sa paghatol sa husgado kung saan mahatulan sila ng kamatayan.



17.33 Nor take life - which Allah has made sacred - except for just cause. And if anyone is slain wrongfully, we have given his heir authority (to demand qisas or to forgive): but let him nor exceed bounds in the matter of taking life; for he is helped (by the Law).


@Any question, ito po ay gawa ng inyong lingkod at hindi po ito galing sa anuman sites at sana po iwasan po ang baling paksa at sumunod lang po sa alinman talatang inilatag ko.

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Sun Apr 03, 2011 11:10 pm

sa pa sa ipinaalaala ng Allah subhana wa taalah na siyang aking sinusunod na kautusan niya.

5:8. And call in remembrance the favour of Allah unto you, and His covenant, which He ratified with you, when ye said: "We hear and we obey": And fear Allah, for Allah knoweth well the secrets of your hearts.


5:9. O ye who believe! stand out firmly for Allah, as witnesses to fair dealing, and let not the hatred of others to you make you swerve to wrong and depart from justice. Be just: that is next to piety: and fear Allah. For Allah is well-acquainted with all that ye do.



Iyan ang dahilan kung bakit hindi po ako kabilang sa tinatawag ninyong terorista sapagkat malinaw ang aral at pahayag ng Allah sa amin.

siya ang nakakaalam kung anuman ang nasa puso namin at hindi kayo, kaya nga sabi niya "for Allah knoweth well the secrets of your hearts"

sinabi rin niya na maging parehas kami sa pagtingin sa sinuman (muslim man o kristiyano) at huwag mamuhi sa kanila upang hindi kami humantong sa kamalian at kawalan ng hustisya, sa tingin kaya ninyo ay ginawa ito ng mga terorista at sila ay tagasunod ng Allah.

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by Abdullah Elero on Mon Apr 04, 2011 12:16 am

Salaam brother,maganda at nadala mo itong topic dito sa new Berean,sa Kabila kasi tinatamad na ako patulad ang walang kalatoy latoy na sagot,kaya nga di na ako nagpopost sa Islam board
Maganda itong topic na Ito dahil Hindi lingid sa kaalaman natin lagi tinatawag na terorista tayong mga Muslim

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Mon Apr 04, 2011 12:30 am

Abdullah Elero wrote:Salaam brother,maganda at nadala mo itong topic dito sa new Berean,sa Kabila kasi tinatamad na ako patulad ang walang kalatoy latoy na sagot,kaya nga di na ako nagpopost sa Islam board
Maganda itong topic na Ito dahil Hindi lingid sa kaalaman natin lagi tinatawag na terorista tayong mga Muslim


Alaikom wasalam brother abdullah, tama ka dinala ko dito sapagkat nakita mo naman ang nangyari sa kabila na binababoy ni kilometrico ito at pinababayaan nila sapagkat alam nila kasi wala silang maisagot sa inilatag ko na ito, kung matapang sila ay dito nila ako sagutin at handa akong dalhin ito sa debate anuman oras.

Natatawa ako na ginagamit nilang dahilan ang mga terorista na tunay daw na tagasunod ng Allah gayong kung tunay ay dapat ay maipakita nila sa atin kung papaano naging tunay na tagasunod ito ng Allah.

Mas maganda brother na huwag ka na pumatol sa kanila sa ISLAM BOARD at hayaan muna silang magkalat kasi dadaanin lang lang sa pang-aasar, kung mayroon tayong dapat sagutin doon ay iyong tunay na naghahanap ng kasagutan tungkol sa Islam.

Wasalam....

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Mon Apr 04, 2011 12:38 am

Naalaala ko ang isa sa hadith patungkol sa sinabi ng propheta Muhammad (pbuh) sa sunan abudawood (Book 41, Number 4877) na ang sabi niya.



Narrated Iyad ibn Himar (al-Mujashi'i):
The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: Allah has revealed to me that you must be humble, so that no one oppresses another and boasts over another

Iyan daw ang ipinahayag ng Allah subhana wa taalah sa mahal na propheta na narinig ng kanyang sahabat na nabanggit niya, so papaano maging terorista ang isang tunay na mananampalataya ng Islam.

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by RavlaM on Mon Apr 04, 2011 12:45 am

Salamat sa paglilinaw Harballah, pero mayroon lang din akong agam-agam sa bagay ng terrorismo na tunay naman na alam ng lahat na mayroong mga terroristang muslim.

Ang katanungan ko ay kung ang mga muslim na terrorista ba ay nasa estado ng pakikipag digmaan?

Isa pang katanungan ay kung nasa pakikipagdigma ang mga muslim, maari po ba silang maging terrorista ayon sa mga alituntunin ni allah sa pakikipagdigma?
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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Mon Apr 04, 2011 1:36 am

RavlaM wrote:Salamat sa paglilinaw Harballah, pero mayroon lang din akong agam-agam sa bagay ng terrorismo na tunay naman na alam ng lahat na mayroong mga terroristang muslim.

Walang anuman ravlam at sana sa paglipat ng thread ko dito mula sa kabila ay mayroon kayong matutunan tungkol sa usapin na ito Insah Allah (God will)



RavlaM wrote:
Ang katanungan ko ay kung ang mga muslim na terrorista ba ay nasa estado ng pakikipag digmaan?

Isa pang katanungan ay kung nasa pakikipagdigma ang mga muslim, maari po ba silang maging terrorista ayon sa mga alituntunin ni allah sa pakikipagdigma?


Tungkol sa digmaan ay mayroon isang bagay na ipinahayag ang Allah subhana wa taalah upang ang isang mananampalatayang Muslim (tunay na tagasunod ng Allah) ay pinapayagan na lumaban o makidigma, narito po ang talata sa Quran.

Gamitin natin ang madalas na ginagamit ng mga anti-islam at madalas na napupulot nila, ngunit ang gagawin natin ay basahin natin ang konteksto at hindi po iyong isang talata lang na ginagamit nila kung saan nakasaad po ang word na ito "And slay them wherever ye catch them ".

Ngayon narito ang talata basi sa binanggit ko na iyan at umpisahan natin sa verse 190 hanggang 193 para malaman natin kung bakit binanggit iyan ng Allah at kung kailan puwedeng ipagtanggol ang sarili o ang relihiyon Islam.


Chapter 2:

190 Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.

191 And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.

192 But if they cease, Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.

193 And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah. but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression.


Ngayon unawain mong mabuti iyong nasa minarkahan ko at puwede kang magtanong upang malaman mo kung bakit ko iyan minarkahan then marami pang talata akong ipapakita pagkatapos natin mapag-usapan ang nasa verso na iyan.


Maraming salamat sa inyong katanungan at nais malaman ang aral ng Islam.

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by RavlaM on Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:21 am

Quran (2:216) "Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is
possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing
which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not."

This verse says that violence can be righteous, from the hadiths we know that Mohammad was trying to motivate his people into raiding caravans.
...............



Quran (4: 74) "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for
the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious,
on him We shall bestow a vast reward."


This may be the theological basis for today's suicide bombers. They are being seduced to fight and die for a cast reward from allah.
.......................

Quran (4: 95) "Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and
those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah with their goods and their
persons. Allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with
their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith)
Hath Allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath He distinguished
above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-"


This passage
criticizes "peaceful" Muslims who do not join in the violence, letting
them know that they are less worthy in Allah's eyes.
...........................................






Bukhari (52: 256) The Prophet... was asked whether it was permissible to
attack the pagan warriors at night with the probability of exposing their women
and children to danger. The Prophet replied, "They (i.e. women and children) are
from them (i.e. pagans)."




In this command, Muhammad establishes that it is
permissible to kill non-combatants in the process of killing a perceived enemy.
This provides justification for the many Islamic terror bombings.
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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:36 pm

Ravlam una sa lahat nais ko munang alamin sa inyo kung nabasa mo ba itong inilatag ko kasi kung sasagutin ko iyan inilatag mo basi lang sa interpretasyon mo gayong hindi mo alam ang exegesis niyan sapagkat isang talata lang ang inilagay mo ay lalabas na kinalimutan mo iyong ipinakita ko sa inyo dito.

Malalayo tayo sa paksang binuksan ko kung mag-quote ka lang basi sa napulot mo sa anti-islam websites as i mentioned before na madalas gamitin ng anti-muslim.

harballah wrote:

Walang anuman ravlam at sana sa paglipat ng thread ko dito mula sa kabila ay mayroon kayong matutunan tungkol sa usapin na ito Insah Allah (God will)






Tungkol sa digmaan ay mayroon isang bagay na ipinahayag ang Allah subhana wa taalah upang ang isang mananampalatayang Muslim (tunay na tagasunod ng Allah) ay pinapayagan na lumaban o makidigma, narito po ang talata sa Quran.

Gamitin natin ang madalas na ginagamit ng mga anti-islam at madalas na napupulot nila, ngunit ang gagawin natin ay basahin natin ang konteksto at hindi po iyong isang talata lang na ginagamit nila kung saan nakasaad po ang word na ito "And slay them wherever ye catch them ".

Ngayon narito ang talata basi sa binanggit ko na iyan at umpisahan natin sa verse 190 hanggang 193 para malaman natin kung bakit binanggit iyan ng Allah at kung kailan puwedeng ipagtanggol ang sarili o ang relihiyon Islam.


Chapter 2:

190 Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.

191 And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.

192 But if they cease, Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.

193 And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah. but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression.


Ngayon unawain mong mabuti iyong nasa minarkahan ko at puwede kang magtanong upang malaman mo kung bakit ko iyan minarkahan then marami pang talata akong ipapakita pagkatapos natin mapag-usapan ang nasa verso na iyan.


Maraming salamat sa inyong katanungan at nais malaman ang aral ng Islam.

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by the700clowns on Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:51 pm

RavlaM wrote:Quran (2:216) "Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is
possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing
which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not."

This verse says that violence can be righteous, from the hadiths we know that Mohammad was trying to motivate his people into raiding caravans.
...............



Quran (4: 74) "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for
the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious,
on him We shall bestow a vast reward."


This may be the theological basis for today's suicide bombers. They are being seduced to fight and die for a cast reward from allah.
.......................

Quran (4: 95) "Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and
those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah with their goods and their
persons. Allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with
their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith)
Hath Allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath He distinguished
above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-"


This passage
criticizes "peaceful" Muslims who do not join in the violence, letting
them know that they are less worthy in Allah's eyes.
...........................................






Bukhari (52: 256) The Prophet... was asked whether it was permissible to
attack the pagan warriors at night with the probability of exposing their women
and children to danger. The Prophet replied, "They (i.e. women and children) are
from them (i.e. pagans)."




In this command, Muhammad establishes that it is
permissible to kill non-combatants in the process of killing a perceived enemy.
This provides justification for the many Islamic terror bombings.

___

hay naku misrepresentation na naman! Mad

talaga pinalalaban sila, pero sa "just war" sila pinalalaban; nun kasi, marami ang ayaw lumaban kaya para mahikayat sila na lumaban e sinabi sa kanila na ang mamatay sa gera e magkakaroon ng reward. pag ayaw mong mamatay sa laban sa ngalan ng pagtatanggol at gusto mo e yung iba na lang ang lumaban habang ikaw e parelax relax sa bahay e ibig sabihin nun e mas mahal mo ang mundong ito kesa sa kabila, meaning kulang ka sa pananampalataya na may naghihintay sayong forever happiness sa paradise. ang pagkaka-alam ko, merong caravan na nire-raid, pero mga gamit nila yun na kinuha ng mga Meccans nung umalis sila para ibenta, binawi lang nila yung kanila.

yung attack sa gabi na pwedeng mag-expose sa mga women and children sa danger e collateral damage, pwedeng napaka-cruicial nung battle na yun kaya hindi maiwasan pero hindi DELIBERATE, iba ang ginagawa ng terrorists na civilians ang inaatake deliberately, sana kung military base na merong civilian e.


bawal sa Islam ang pumatay DELIBERATELY ng innocent people


Saheeh Bukhari

Volume 004, Book 052, Hadith Number 257.

Narrated By 'Abdullah : During some of the Ghazawat of the Prophet a woman was found killed. Allah's Apostle disapproved the killing of women and children.



Volume 004, Book 052, Hadith Number 258.

Narrated By Ibn 'Umar : During some of the Ghazawat of Allah's Apostle a woman was found killed, so Allah's Apostle forbade the killing of women and children.


just war ang allowed sa Islam

"Fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for God loveth not transgressors. (The Noble Quran, 2:190)"

"But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace, and trust in God: for He is One that heareth and knoweth (all things). (The Noble Quran, 8:61)"


"God does not forbid you from showing kindness and dealing justly with those who have not fought you about religion and have not driven you out of your homes. God loves just dealers. (The Noble Quran, 60:Cool"
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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by Ateo on Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:52 pm

Harballah, wag mong gamitin ang exegesis defense na palaging ginagamit ng mga Ebangheliko. Di naman kailangan ng exegesis para maintindihan ang sinabi ng Quran. Malinaw ang mga bersikulo na ipinakita ni RavlaM, di po ba? Baka kasi lalabo lang pag gamitan natin ng exegesis.

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Mon Apr 04, 2011 3:29 pm

Ateo wrote:Harballah, wag mong gamitin ang exegesis defense na palaging ginagamit ng mga Ebangheliko. Di naman kailangan ng exegesis para maintindihan ang sinabi ng Quran. Malinaw ang mga bersikulo na ipinakita ni RavlaM, di po ba? Baka kasi lalabo lang pag gamitan natin ng exegesis.

Ateo nabasa mo ba iyong post ko hindi na mismong exegesis na galing sa akin iyon kundi mismong galing sa Allah, iyon kasing mga anti-islam gumagamit ng isang talata pero bakit hindi nila subukan kunin ang nasa unahan at hulihan para masagot tanong nila, tulad nitong post ko.

Madalas ginagamit nila ang nasa verse 2:191, ngayon ano po iyong binanggit sa verse 190 at 192 and 193.

Uso kasi sa kanila ang "DON'T KILL HIM" ngayon aalisin iyong "DON'T" para ang labas ay "KILL HIM" ganyan ang ginagawa nila sa Quran.



harballah wrote:

Walang anuman ravlam at sana sa paglipat ng thread ko dito mula sa kabila ay mayroon kayong matutunan tungkol sa usapin na ito Insah Allah (God will)






Tungkol sa digmaan ay mayroon isang bagay na ipinahayag ang Allah subhana wa taalah upang ang isang mananampalatayang Muslim (tunay na tagasunod ng Allah) ay pinapayagan na lumaban o makidigma, narito po ang talata sa Quran.

Gamitin natin ang madalas na ginagamit ng mga anti-islam at madalas na napupulot nila, ngunit ang gagawin natin ay basahin natin ang konteksto at hindi po iyong isang talata lang na ginagamit nila kung saan nakasaad po ang word na ito "And slay them wherever ye catch them ".

Ngayon narito ang talata basi sa binanggit ko na iyan at umpisahan natin sa verse 190 hanggang 193 para malaman natin kung bakit binanggit iyan ng Allah at kung kailan puwedeng ipagtanggol ang sarili o ang relihiyon Islam.


Chapter 2:

190 Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.

191 And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.

192 But if they cease, Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.

193 And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah. but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression.


Ngayon unawain mong mabuti iyong nasa minarkahan ko at puwede kang magtanong upang malaman mo kung bakit ko iyan minarkahan then marami pang talata akong ipapakita pagkatapos natin mapag-usapan ang nasa verso na iyan.


Maraming salamat sa inyong katanungan at nais malaman ang aral ng Islam.



Sige ateo tell me mali bang kunin ang nasa unahan at hulihan para masagot ang tanong ng mga nagkowt ng Quran.

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by RavlaM on Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:20 pm

Harballah, I have posted clear quranic verses that proves that in times of war terrorism is allowed.
Malinaw di ba? Paano mo wawasakin ang mga verses na yan eh talaga namang legitimate na sa quran at hadith ang mga yan. I say those are concrete evidence.

Malinaw at kumpleto ang mga verses na yan. Prove to me your contention about your "Do not kill him to Kill him" statement.

Tell me the real meaning of those verses and convince me that my understanding was wrong about those verses.

About your "just war" issue, can you explain to us what is "just" in the standards of Islam at times of war?
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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Mon Apr 04, 2011 11:08 pm

RavlaM wrote:Harballah, I have posted clear quranic verses that proves that in times of war terrorism is allowed.
Malinaw di ba? Paano mo wawasakin ang mga verses na yan eh talaga namang legitimate na sa quran at hadith ang mga yan. I say those are concrete evidence.

Malinaw at kumpleto ang mga verses na yan. Prove to me your contention about your "Do not kill him to Kill him" statement.

Tell me the real meaning of those verses and convince me that my understanding was wrong about those verses.

About your "just war" issue, can you explain to us what is "just" in the standards of Islam at times of war?

Ravlam nakita mo ba o nabasa iyong post ko kung saan allowed iyong pakikidigma, ni hindi mo na nga kinomentuhan at papaano tayo uusad niyan kung hindi pa tayo tapos doon sa tanong mo na sinagot ko lulukso ka in another verse na naayon lang sa interpretasyon mo.

Gaano karin ba kasigurado na tama ang interpretasyon mo at tulad ng interpretasyon mo ay ganyan din ang interpetasyon ng mga terorista, hindi ba dapat basahin mo muna ang sagot ko na ito sa iyo at komentuhan mo.

Galing kasi iyan sa tanong mo na ito.


RavlaM wrote:
Ang katanungan ko ay kung ang mga muslim na terrorista ba ay nasa estado ng pakikipag digmaan?

Isa pang katanungan ay kung nasa pakikipagdigma ang mga muslim, maari po ba silang maging terrorista ayon sa mga alituntunin ni allah sa pakikipagdigma?

Kung saan ito naman ang sagot.

harballah wrote:
Tungkol sa digmaan ay mayroon isang bagay na ipinahayag ang Allah subhana wa taalah upang ang isang mananampalatayang Muslim (tunay na tagasunod ng Allah) ay pinapayagan na lumaban o makidigma, narito po ang talata sa Quran.

Gamitin natin ang madalas na ginagamit ng mga anti-islam at madalas na napupulot nila, ngunit ang gagawin natin ay basahin natin ang konteksto at hindi po iyong isang talata lang na ginagamit nila kung saan nakasaad po ang word na ito "And slay them wherever ye catch them ".

Ngayon narito ang talata basi sa binanggit ko na iyan at umpisahan natin sa verse 190 hanggang 193 para malaman natin kung bakit binanggit iyan ng Allah at kung kailan puwedeng ipagtanggol ang sarili o ang relihiyon Islam.


Chapter 2:

190 Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.

191 And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.

192 But if they cease, Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.

193 And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah. but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression.


Ngayon unawain mong mabuti iyong nasa minarkahan ko at puwede kang magtanong upang malaman mo kung bakit ko iyan minarkahan then marami pang talata akong ipapakita pagkatapos natin mapag-usapan ang nasa verso na iyan.


Maraming salamat sa inyong katanungan at nais malaman ang aral ng Islam.

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Mon Apr 04, 2011 11:09 pm

Ngayon hindi ba puwedeng bago kayo lumukso sa usapin ay pag-usapan muna natin kung tanggap mo ang sagot ko na iyan sa tanong mo kasi hindi po ito paramihan ng mga verses kundi sagutan at paliwanagan kung bakit nandiyan ang talatang iyan o bakit ibinaba ng Allah subhana wa taalah.

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by RavlaM on Tue Apr 05, 2011 12:46 am

Nalulungkot ako at mali ata ang tinutumbok mo Harballah, walng kuniksyon ang mga talata na binagggit ko sa ibinabandera mong "And slay them whenever ye catch them"

Pagbibigyan ko na ang verses mo ang talakayin:


Chapter 2:

190 Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.


*Do you think that all wars involving Muslims are in the cause of allah?

I don't know what limits are you saying:

Bukhari (50:369) - Recounts the murder of a poet, Ka'b bin al-Ashraf, at
Muhammad's insistence.
The men who volunteered for the assassination used
dishonesty to gain Ka'b's trust, pretending that they had turned against
Muhammad. This drew the victim out of his fortress, whereupon he was
brutally slaughtered despite putting up a ferocious struggle for his life.

Did you notice the word "murder" tell me now...what limits?
Plus the word "dishonesty" what limits?


............................................................


191
And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they
have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than
slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.

Exactly: "Slay them whenever ye catch them"...
Please explain this "
Such is the reward of those who suppress faith" I will ask you again, are all wars involving muslims in allah's cause? Such as suppression of their faith?
* This verse is for those who suppress the muslim faith not the normal war of different dispute.
.......................................

192 But if they cease, Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.

* please explain this, who ceases and on what?
........................................................

*
193 And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah. but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression.

I googled the meaning of "tulmut:


tumult [ˈtjuːmʌlt]n1. a loud confused noise, as of a crowd; commotion
2. violent agitation or disturbance
3. great emotional or mental agitation

I guess this is what Khadaffi is doing killing those who disturb his reign, the people are getting emotional and violently agitated by Gadaffi's insistent to stay in power.
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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Tue Apr 05, 2011 1:20 am

RavlaM wrote:Nalulungkot ako at mali ata ang tinutumbok mo Harballah, walng kuniksyon ang mga talata na binagggit ko sa ibinabandera mong "And slay them whenever ye catch them"

Pagbibigyan ko na ang verses mo ang talakayin:


Chapter 2:

190 Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.


*Do you think that all wars involving Muslims are in the cause of allah?

I don't know what limits are you saying:

Bukhari (50:369) - Recounts the murder of a poet, Ka'b bin al-Ashraf, at
Muhammad's insistence.
The men who volunteered for the assassination used
dishonesty to gain Ka'b's trust, pretending that they had turned against
Muhammad. This drew the victim out of his fortress, whereupon he was
brutally slaughtered despite putting up a ferocious struggle for his life.

Did you notice the word "murder" tell me now...what limits?
Plus the word "dishonesty" what limits?


............................................................


Ngayon ano po ang sabi diyan, lumaban para kanino kundi doon sa "those who fight you" at sino ang mga ito, sila po iyong mga paganong quraishi at mga hudyong nakipagsabwatan sa kanila.


About kay Ka'b bin Al-Ashraf bakit siya pinatay medyo napag-usapan na natin iyan sa ibang thread at hindi mo ba alam kung ano ang binanggit na "but do not transgress limits", ibig sabihin niyan brad ay huwag umabuso o kung ang isang kalaban ay sumuko na ay huwag mo na siyang patayin, gets mo ?



RavlaM wrote:191
And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they
have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than
slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.

Exactly: "Slay them whenever ye catch them"...
Please explain this "
Such is the reward of those who suppress faith" I will ask you again, are all wars involving muslims in allah's cause? Such as suppression of their faith?
* This verse is for those who suppress the muslim faith not the normal war of different dispute.
.......................................

192 But if they cease, Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.

* please explain this, who ceases and on what?
........................................................

Ang talatang iyan ay pag-utos na kung saan ang umatake ay dapat patayin din ngunit malinaw din sa talata na kapag ang kalaban na ito ay sumuko "if they cease" ay dapat huwag na silang patayin sapagkat ang Allah ay maawain at mahabagin., kaya nga malinaw iyong nasa kasunod na talata ang verse 193.

193 And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah. but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression.

Kaya nga may dalawa ka diyan na mababasa.

1) until there is no more Tumult or oppression
2) but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression

Intindihin mo lang mabuti brad ravlam.


RavlaM wrote:

*
193 And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah. but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression.

I googled the meaning of "tulmut:


tumult [ˈtjuːmʌlt]n1. a loud confused noise, as of a crowd; commotion
2. violent agitation or disturbance
3. great emotional or mental agitation

I guess this is what Khadaffi is doing killing those who disturb his reign, the people are getting emotional and violently agitated by Gadaffi's insistent to stay in power.

Brad may paliwanag na ako diyan sa verse 193 at about Khadafi puwede natin pag-usapan iyan in separate thread at alamin natin kung nahuhulog ba ito sa nakasaad sa talatang iyan.

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Tue Apr 05, 2011 2:13 am

RavlaM wrote:
Quran (4: 74) "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for
the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious,
on him We shall bestow a vast reward."


This may be the theological basis for today's suicide bombers. They are being seduced to fight and die for a cast reward from allah.

Sige pagbigyan kita diyan sa napulot mo na talata, ngayon pakibasa iyong sumunod na talata diyan kung bakit kailangan nilang lumaban.;


Chapter 4
74. Let those fight in the cause of Allah Who sell the life of this world for the hereafter. To him who fighteth in the cause of Allah,- whether he is slain or gets victory - Soon shall We give him a reward of great (value).

75. And why should ye not fight in the cause of Allah and of those who, being weak, are ill-treated (and oppressed)?- Men, women, and children, whose cry is: "Our Lord! Rescue us from this town, whose people are oppressors; and raise for us from thee one who will protect; and raise for us from thee one who will help!"

76. Those who believe fight in the cause of Allah, and those who reject Faith Fight in the cause of Evil: So fight ye against the friends of Satan: feeble indeed is the cunning of Satan.


Ano po ang binanggit diyan sa verse 75 na nakalimutan mo yatang isama para mabasa ang konteksto ng nasabing talata, huwag mong kalimutan na mismong sa mga kasunod na talata ang sagot sa inilatag mo.

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by the700clowns on Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:07 am

ang terrorism e yung nasa Bible:

Deuteronomy 20:16 But of the cities of these people, which the LORD thy God doth give thee for an inheritance, thou shalt save alive nothing that breatheth:

pinapapatay ang innocent people No
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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by RavlaM on Tue Apr 05, 2011 11:19 am

Post by RavlaM
Chapter 2:

190 Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.

*Do you think that all wars involving Muslims are in the cause of allah?

I don't know what limits are you saying:

Bukhari (50:369) - Recounts the murder of a poet, Ka'b bin al-Ashraf, at
Muhammad's insistence.
The men who volunteered for the assassination used
dishonesty to gain Ka'b's trust, pretending that they had turned against
Muhammad. This drew the victim out of his fortress, whereupon he was
brutally slaughtered despite putting up a ferocious struggle for his life.

Did you notice the word "murder" tell me now...what limits?
Plus the word "dishonesty" what limits?

Answer of Harballah to my post....Ngayon ano po ang sabi diyan, lumaban para kanino kundi doon sa "those who fight you" at sino ang mga ito, sila po iyong mga paganong quraishi at mga hudyong nakipagsabwatan sa kanila.


About
kay Ka'b bin Al-Ashraf bakit siya pinatay medyo napag-usapan na natin
iyan sa ibang thread at hindi mo ba alam kung ano ang binanggit na "but do not transgress limits", ibig sabihin niyan brad ay huwag umabuso o kung ang isang kalaban ay sumuko na ay huwag mo na siyang patayin, gets mo ?
................................................................................................................................

Sorry Harby mukhang walang lalim ang mga pinagsasabi mo..
Hindi mo sinagot ang katanungan ko....

*Do you think that all wars involving Muslims are in the cause of allah?

Ang tugon mo sa tanong ko na:

I don't know what limits are you saying:

* Ang kasagutan o aY huwag umabuso.....at wag patayin kung sumusuko na.....Mukhang masyadong mababaw yan kaibigan at anong wag umabuso? ano ang pangaabuso?

Kaya ko pinoste ang pag patay kay Al Ashraf kasi nakita ko ang pangaabuso ni Muhammad, it talks about his "murderous act and his deciet"

At ang pinakamalupit ay...
.......****

Narito po ang poste mo..

[color=black]Ngayon ano po ang sabi diyan, lumaban para kanino kundi doon sa "those who fight you" at sino ang mga ito, sila po iyong mga paganong quraishi at mga hudyong nakipagsabwatan sa kanila.

Ang sinasabi mo patukoy sa talatang nagsasaad ng "those who fight you" O para di tayo malito sa talatang ito..

Chapter 2:190 Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.

Ang sabi mo dito ay...."sila po iyong mga paganong quraishi at mga hudyong nakipagsabwatan sa kanila."
So kung ganoon ay ito pala para patukoy specifically sa mga binanggit mong Qurayshi at hudyong nakikipag sabwatan.......ibig sabihin ay walang aral na ibinibigay......

Isusunod na lang natin ang ibang talata na nilatag ni Harby.
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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Tue Apr 05, 2011 2:32 pm

Brad malinaw naman ang sagot ko at baka lang naman hindi naging malinaw sa inyo ang tugon ko, in fact hindi po lahat ng laban ng Muslim ay sa Allah kaya nga tinatalakay natin itong nasa thread ko basi sa inilatag kung mga talata upang makita natin kung sa Allah ba ang ginagawa nila, in fact ang nais ko sana ay ipakita ninyo kung ang terorista ba ay nakasunod sa Allah basi sa inilatag ko sa first premises ko, pero ang ginagawa mo naglatag ka ng naglatag ng verses naayon lang sa interpretasyon mo at nakakatuwa nga ni hindi mo inilagay ang ibang talata upang mauunawaan ang konteskto, tingnan mo dito sa isang post verse mo na na ipinakita ko sa inyo ang kasunod na talata.


RavlaM wrote:
Quran (4: 74) "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for
the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious,
on him We shall bestow a vast reward."


This may be the theological basis for today's suicide bombers. They are being seduced to fight and die for a cast reward from allah.

ito naman ang ibang talata sa kinowt mo.


harballah wrote:
Sige pagbigyan kita diyan sa napulot mo na talata, ngayon pakibasa iyong sumunod na talata diyan kung bakit kailangan nilang lumaban.;


Chapter 4
74. Let those fight in the cause of Allah Who sell the life of this world for the hereafter. To him who fighteth in the cause of Allah,- whether he is slain or gets victory - Soon shall We give him a reward of great (value).

75. And why should ye not fight in the cause of Allah and of those who, being weak, are ill-treated (and oppressed)?- Men, women, and children, whose cry is: "Our Lord! Rescue us from this town, whose people are oppressors; and raise for us from thee one who will protect; and raise for us from thee one who will help!"

76. Those who believe fight in the cause of Allah, and those who reject Faith Fight in the cause of Evil: So fight ye against the friends of Satan: feeble indeed is the cunning of Satan.


Ano po ang binanggit diyan sa verse 75 na nakalimutan mo yatang isama para mabasa ang konteksto ng nasabing talata, huwag mong kalimutan na mismong sa mga kasunod na talata ang sagot sa inilatag mo.

Nakita mo ba ang pagkakaiba ng isang talata lang, hindi mo nalalaman ang konteksto nito, kung ganyan ka ng ganyan ay wala tayong pupuntahan kasi baka mauwi lang ito sa wala, in fact hindi mo alam ang usapin kay Kab bin Ashraf.

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Tue Apr 05, 2011 2:34 pm

ravlam tandaan mo na ang usapin ko dito ay ang mga terorista at hindi si kab bin ashraf at hindi rin si khaddafi o sinuman indibidwal, kaya nga inilatag ko ang unang premises ko para malaman natin kung sa allah ba ang mga terorista kaso kung saan-saan mo dinadala ang usapin No

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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by RavlaM on Tue Apr 05, 2011 5:44 pm

harballah wrote:ravlam tandaan mo na ang usapin ko dito ay ang mga terorista at hindi si kab bin ashraf at hindi rin si khaddafi o sinuman indibidwal, kaya nga inilatag ko ang unang premises ko para malaman natin kung sa allah ba ang mga terorista kaso kung saan-saan mo dinadala ang usapin No

Masyado masyado naman ata na minaliit ang pag banggit ko sa kanila. Sana tandaan mo rin na na kaa ko binanggit ang mga personalidad na yan ay para maintindihan mong maigi.

Unang una si Ashraf na "iniutos ipapatay ni mohammad" na ang kanilang pagkakapatay ay hinaluan nila ng panlilinlang na kunwari ay sila ay mga taong tumiwalag kay munammad......kaya ko nabanggit ang hadith ay ang pamamaraan ni Mohammad sa pakikidigma ay pasok sa limit na sinasabi mo..

At si Gaddaffi ay nabanggit dahil sa pinoste mong "Tulmut" ng igoogle ko po ang ibig sabihin ay unrest, or noisy commotion...ang nasabi ata ay labanan sila kaya nasabi ko sa situwasyon ni Gaddafi ganoon ga ang sinusunod niya ...ang patayin ang mga protesters.
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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by RavlaM on Tue Apr 05, 2011 5:56 pm

Chapter 4
74. Let those fight in the cause of Allah Who sell the life of this world for the hereafter. To him who fighteth in the cause of Allah,- whether he is slain or gets victory - Soon shall We give him a reward of great (value).

75. And why should ye not fight in the cause of Allah and of those who, being weak, are ill-treated (and oppressed)?- Men, women, and children, whose cry is: "Our Lord! Rescue us from this town, whose people are oppressors; and raise for us from thee one who will protect; and raise for us from thee one who will help!"

76. Those who believe fight in the cause of Allah, and those who reject Faith Fight in the cause of Evil: So fight ye against the friends of Satan: feeble indeed is the cunning of Satan.

Ang hirap sa iyo eh pag mg post ka ng talata eh kinukulayan mo pa ..hayaan mo nang kulay itim para madaling mabasa......
Anyway ng post ka namg ng talata at di man laman magbigay ng argumento....pipilitin ko na lang intindihin ka kahit di ko alam ang laman ng utak mo..

So nagdagdag ka ng kasunod na verse......so ngayon sabihin na nating may dahilan dahil the women and children are being oppressed you may have valid cause but the way they are fighting is the question....Allah tells his people that to die in war they will receive vast amounts of rewards meaning they are being bribed to die...
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Re: Ang terorista ba ay tagasunod ng allah

Post by harballah on Tue Apr 05, 2011 6:00 pm

RavlaM wrote:
Masyado masyado naman ata na minaliit ang pag banggit ko sa kanila. Sana tandaan mo rin na na kaa ko binanggit ang mga personalidad na yan ay para maintindihan mong maigi.

Brad malinaw naman siguro sa inyo ang paksa ko tungkol sa terorista at nais natin pag-usapan kung basi sa ginagawa ng terorista ay naayon ba sa mga inilatag ko na talata, iyon dapat ang sisirain ninyo at pasinungalingan at hindi kung ano-anong indibidwal na tao ang isinasangkot ninyo.



RavlaM wrote:
Unang una si Ashraf na "iniutos ipapatay ni mohammad" na ang kanilang pagkakapatay ay hinaluan nila ng panlilinlang na kunwari ay sila ay mga taong tumiwalag kay munammad......kaya ko nabanggit ang hadith ay ang pamamaraan ni Mohammad sa pakikidigma ay pasok sa limit na sinasabi mo..

Brad sa isang labanan ba ay hindi puwedeng gamitan ng ideya upang mapatay mo ang kalaban mo, halimbawa nanghuhuli ka ng hayop sa gubat ay hindi kaba gagamit na bitag para sa kanila, common sense.

Ngayon sino ba ang nag-isip na gawin iyon ang propheta ba o suggestion lang sa kanya, kung gusto mo talakayin natin ng separate thread para hindi tayo nalalayo kasi ang usapin dito ay hindi si Kaab kundi ang mga terorista sa panahon ngayon at hindi po ang kalaban ng propheta sa panahon noon.



RavlaM wrote:At si Gaddaffi ay nabanggit dahil sa pinoste mong "Tulmut" ng igoogle ko po ang ibig sabihin ay unrest, or noisy commotion...ang nasabi ata ay labanan sila kaya nasabi ko sa situwasyon ni Gaddafi ganoon ga ang sinusunod niya ...ang patayin ang mga protesters.

So, gusto mo bang pag-usapan natin ng separate thread at unawain natin kung ano ang stand ko about KHADAFI kung siya ba ay nasa tama o mali, kasi malalayo tayo sa tunay na layunin ng thread ko, gusto mo gawa ako ng separate thread o ikaw na mismo ang gumawa.

Thanks and peace!

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